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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 10:57 am 
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Broodling

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xsquidz wrote:
Were you rolling both and armour and an invulnerable save? That is what it sounds like you are saying and if so you don't get both.

lakouang wrote:
Rolling both saves was not possible in previous editions, so I think he meant Save and FNP rolls.

Regards,

Lak


What Lak said.

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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 6:12 pm 
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Medium One

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xsquidz wrote:
Cover saves do not applied in CC sadly. Plus I think intervening model cover is gone as far as I can tell.


I did a little more digging, it looked like the combat phase rules said resolve all wounds and armour saves exactly like how it's done in the shooting phase.

http://pro.bols.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/figh-and-morale.jpg

It seems like that cover saves are used in CC, but I could be misreading how that is supposed to work.

If it does, then I think that means Lictors get a +3 armour save in cover. But, that also would mean that the unit you're attacking does as well, which means Rending Claws can be great for in cover fighting.

I hope I'm reading that right. +1 to hit lictors and a +2 armour save in cover would be awesome. =)

Edited, because wasn't sure about posting rule pics. Playing it safe while still providing a link. =)


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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 8:00 pm 
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Big One
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DigestedFotoGuy wrote:
xsquidz wrote:
Cover saves do not applied in CC sadly. Plus I think intervening model cover is gone as far as I can tell.


I did a little more digging, it looked like the combat phase rules said resolve all wounds and armour saves exactly like how it's done in the shooting phase.

http://pro.bols.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/figh-and-morale.jpg

It seems like that cover saves are used in CC, but I could be misreading how that is supposed to work.

If it does, then I think that means Lictors get a +3 armour save in cover. But, that also would mean that the unit you're attacking does as well, which means Rending Claws can be great for in cover fighting.

I hope I'm reading that right. +1 to hit lictors and a +2 armour save in cover would be awesome. =)

Edited, because wasn't sure about posting rule pics. Playing it safe while still providing a link. =)


Check page 181 on the sidebar called Terrain and Cover.

The last sentence says.
"Units gain no benefit from cover in the fight phase"

Sorry.

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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 8:40 pm 
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Medium One

Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 11:51 pm
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xsquidz wrote:

Check page 181 on the sidebar called Terrain and Cover.

The last sentence says.
"Units gain no benefit from cover in the fight phase"

Sorry.


Awesome, thanks for pointing it out. I haven't read a cohesive set of the rules, it's always been bits & pieces.

I guess the last thing to say is, nuts, and to get venomthropes near my Lictors. =)


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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 8:50 pm 
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Big One
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DigestedFotoGuy wrote:
xsquidz wrote:

Check page 181 on the sidebar called Terrain and Cover.

The last sentence says.
"Units gain no benefit from cover in the fight phase"

Sorry.


Awesome, thanks for pointing it out. I haven't read a cohesive set of the rules, it's always been bits & pieces.

I guess the last thing to say is, nuts, and to get venomthropes near my Lictors. =)


I think venomthropes are going to be amazing because -1 to hit is really good. If heavy weapons move, thats -2 in total, if assault weapons advance its the same -2. Then the horror gives any 1 unit you target another -1 so it could be a -3 and in this edition you don't always hit on 6's or anything, so units that hit on 4+ can't even fire at you if you give them a -3. :)

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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 9:22 pm 
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Medium One

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xsquidz wrote:

I think venomthropes are going to be amazing because -1 to hit is really good. If heavy weapons move, thats -2 in total, if assault weapons advance its the same -2. Then the horror gives any 1 unit you target another -1 so it could be a -3 and in this edition you don't always hit on 6's or anything, so units that hit on 4+ can't even fire at you if you give them a -3. :)


Oh dang, that can happen? I didn't think you could make it so something was unhittable. That's going to be great if you can combo them all together. =)


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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 9:35 pm 
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Big One
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DigestedFotoGuy wrote:
xsquidz wrote:

I think venomthropes are going to be amazing because -1 to hit is really good. If heavy weapons move, thats -2 in total, if assault weapons advance its the same -2. Then the horror gives any 1 unit you target another -1 so it could be a -3 and in this edition you don't always hit on 6's or anything, so units that hit on 4+ can't even fire at you if you give them a -3. :)


Oh dang, that can happen? I didn't think you could make it so something was unhittable. That's going to be great if you can combo them all together. =)


Yep you can, but even if you get marines shooting on 5's or 6's it would be pretty awesome. Or they will need to sacrifice movement to keep better ballistic skill, both are good!

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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 3:03 am 
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Not Loukang
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Regarding the venomthropes to hit modifier. Is it also appliable with otherwatch? I mean casting horror on an enemy unit so it have to hit on 7+? Or is overwatch a result 6 fixed roll?

Lak


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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Wed Jun 14, 2017 8:01 am 
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Big One
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lakouang wrote:
Regarding the venomthropes to hit modifier. Is it also appliable with otherwatch? I mean casting horror on an enemy unit so it have to hit on 7+? Or is overwatch a result 6 fixed roll?

Lak


It's always a 6 regardless of modifiers it says.

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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 3:32 pm 
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So it looks like the tervigon is now super-expensive in points, and you have to pay extra for the termagants as well. Any reactions?

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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 6:22 pm 
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Big One
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HiveFleetManticore wrote:
So it looks like the tervigon is now super-expensive in points, and you have to pay extra for the termagants as well. Any reactions?


Tervigon is a beast tho, T7, 14W I think. Plus if you add 10 fleshborer gaunts to an existing unit then its free, only if you create a unit does it cost points. So take 30 man units with 10-20 devilgaunts and always kill the fleshborer ones first and replace them. :)

I am also pretty sure it has a cheap way to do D6 wounds in combat with every attack! I saw a bat rep where a tervigon murdered a daemon prince.

However I have yet to use it myself so hard to say but alot of things are way more expensive but did get better because of it, rhinos are like 100 points now I think but are as tough as a hive tyrant or close to it.

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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 9:21 pm 
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Monstrosity
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HiveFleetManticore wrote:
So it looks like the tervigon is now super-expensive in points, and you have to pay extra for the termagants as well. Any reactions?

It's still a great addition to your bugs, but now it's more like a Land Raider than a Gant-pooping rage monster.

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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 11:03 am 
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Broodling

Joined: Tue Nov 24, 2009 4:44 pm
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Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
xsquidz wrote:
HiveFleetManticore wrote:
So it looks like the tervigon is now super-expensive in points, and you have to pay extra for the termagants as well. Any reactions?


Plus if you add 10 fleshborer gaunts to an existing unit then its free, only if you create a unit does it cost points.


It's debatable if the existing units are free, the only things that are for sure free are Spore Mines and Mucolid Spores as it specifically states that they are in their special rules.

*Edit*

p.126 of Index: Xenos 2 under Reinforcement Points it clarifies that replenishing a squad is free spawning a new squad costs points.

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Last edited by sac_ld on Sun Jun 18, 2017 9:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Sat Jun 17, 2017 10:10 pm 
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Little One
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so does anyone have any thoughts on the carnifex's new profile? I'm still not sure about it but i only just got my index and have yet to play a game with them.


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 Post subject: Re: New Edition Rumours - and Pyrovores
PostPosted: Mon Jun 19, 2017 8:15 am 
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Monstrosity
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grendel wrote:
so does anyone have any thoughts on the carnifex's new profile? I'm still not sure about it but i only just got my index and have yet to play a game with them.

I should be getting mine on Tuesday and can get more into it. From what I've seen on battle reports, the Nid bigs don't have a huge number of attacks, but they deal a lot of damage (so each wound does multiple damage.

Since damage doesn't bleed beyond the model the wound was inflicted on, it means that, while the Nid bigs are good at taking out vehicles and multi-wound models, they're not so good at taking out hordes. So point the 'Fex at vehicles and elites - not swarms. Swarms are for Genestealers.

Weirdly, it looks like spore mines work the same way: so they're not good at taking out swarms of infantry.

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